The Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) abandoned governance when former President Olusegun Obasano and his erstwhile deputy, Atiku Abubakar, took different positions and began a fight that lasted beyond their second term, the former Vice President has said. Speaking to select journalists in Abuja mid last week, Atiku said the PDP lost focus and track from 2003, when it deviated from the basic principles that the founding fathers of the party came together to form the party for. “And it continued till today; it is no longer what we formed at the inception…I have never been so disturbed in all my life about Nigeria as I am now,” Atiku said. “Nothing seems to be going right for us. Nothing! Absolutely nothing! Whether it is politics; whether it is governance; whether it is business…Forget about all these growth numbers they give: we are growing by 7.6, 7.5 percent, this and that. Where is the growth? As far as the ordinary man is concerned there is no growth. It means the growth is just concentrated in a few hands,” he added.
When asked whether he could sincerely isolate himself from the problems given that it began in 2003 when he was still a factor, the former Vice President said, “I cannot isolate myself because from 2003 when the president and I took different positions, there was no more governance. In his second term, we were still busy fighting. So, the entire focus of governance that we set up during our first tenure; the economic reforms, this and that, everything was abandoned and we continued fighting till the end,” he said. Atiku said he was able to survive the fight against his boss because he was right. On how he felt when former EFCC Chairman Nuhu Ribadu and former FCT Minister, Nasir el-Rufai, abandoned him during his ordeal
in the hands of Obasanjo, he said, “When I spoke to one of them, he said it was a power game and that they wanted power too.” The former Vice President who was said to have brought Rbiadu and el-Rufai into the government failed to mention who among the two he spoke with. Atiku, Ribadu and el-Rufai are currently chieftains of the opposition All Progressives Congress (APC). When asked the state of his current relation with the duo especially that they meet at the highest level of the party, he said, “As a politician and as a democrat, if you cannot manage differences, then you should not be there. I think it is part of leadership. You should be able to manage others.” The former Vice President who abandoned the PDP, for the second time recently said he did so because he found that he was not relevant in the party.
He said efforts to refocus the PDP were being blocked by those who did not know how the party was formed in the first place. “A party is not a religion. Even religion, people change. I mean, you see some people changing from Islam to Christianity Muslims and vice versa. That is religion. I mean, worshipping God, not to talk of party. By the way, how many of us founding fathers are today left in the PDP? Tell me how many.
Almost all of them are gone. Those who cannot afford to remain in politics have retired simply because the party has been taken over by people who should not in the first place be there,” he said. Atiku said he believed that people who don’t want to conform, or who want to have their way by any means, where among those, who appear to be jittery about his politics. “And as far as I am concerned, I won’t take it.
I must insist on what I believe in – democracy, good governance, rule of law and so on and so forth,” he said.From 1993 when you first showed face, you have been around on the Nigerian political terrain. What makes you tick? I have been a factor in Nigeria’s politics because I stick to what I believe in, whether it suits my personal ambition or not for instance, I cannot compromise on democracy, I cannot compromise on rule of law, I cannot compromise on the unity of this country and at the same time, I also cannot compromise the fact that this country is composed of diverse nationalities. And we should each be allowed to grow at our own pace. There is too much power at the centre. Too much! Too much!
Contrary to the reason you adduced, some people are of the opinion that you have remained a factor in the nation’s politics because of your stupendous wealth. Isn’t that correct?
I don’t consider myself as somebody who is fabulously rich. I am just comfortable and that is all, what I believe every Nigerian wants to be, to be comfortable to afford what you can eat…You can buy akpu, you can buy tuwo and you can buy eba. That is it! You were forced again within the period of this democracy to leave the party you founded. How do you feel? A party is not a religion. Even religion, people change. I mean, you see some people changing from Islam to Christianity and vice versa. That is religion. I mean, worshipping God, not to talk of party. By the way, how many of us founding fathers are today left in the PDP? Tell me how many. Almost all of them are gone. Those who cannot afford to remain in politics have retired simply because the party has been taken over by people who should not in the first place be there. When you were in the PDP, there was the fear of Atiku in some quarters, and when you crossed over to the APC, we hear that there is the fear of Atiku.
How do you feel about the seeming fear that your name causes in some politicians? Maybe they are people who don’t want to conform; people who want to have their way by any means. And as far as I am concerned, I won’t take it. I must insist on what I believe- democracy, good governance, rule of law and so on and so forth.
When you went to the University of Nigeria, Nsukka, some students reportedly shouted out to you that they were hungry. How did you feel? What I have observed in our universities is that they are overcrowded. In other words, we built a university for a population of 10,000 students but now they have about 30,000 there.
Obviously the capacity of the university has been exceeded and I think it is wrong. Instead of exceeding your capacity, you could build more universities that can provide the necessary capacity to educate and train these kids.
I have been in education for almost 20 years now and I started from kindergarten. From the day I started that kindergarten, I said there is no way you can have more than 25 kids in a class. And it is so till today, up to the secondary school. When I started a university, I said there is no way you can have more than 17 students per lecturer.
And it is so. So, if they try to admit more than that, I say no, I cannot compromise on the quality. But I went to the University of Lagos when I was Vice President and I was scared because the students’ hostels were like jail houses. They were sleeping on top of each other and the place was so dirty. No maintenance, windows are broken; it is incredible!
You can’t believe that these are children of human beings staying there. I went to the University of Ibadan, the same thing. And last week, I was a the University of Nigeria, Nsukka, the same thing. These are first generation universities. There is something fundamentally wrong in governance in this country. Back to politics.
Your political associates in the PDM are not happy that you defected from PDP to APC instead of PDM whose registration is linked to you. How do you feel about this?
I don’t know how the PDM was registered. I don’t know. But I agree that I have many political associates in PDM and there are some who are not. PDM has people who were not in politics before and they felt that PDM is the right place for them.
How do you react to this feeling that PDM is a platform you have kept in waiting? No. Certainly not. I have political associates in PDP, PDM, in APC and even in APGA and other political parties. Some people consider you , like the late MKO Abiola, to have friends across the nation . How were you able to achieve this? The reason is that in my public service days, I worked in all parts of the country. I worked in the West, in the East, and in the North. And I cultivated a lot of bridges and friendship among the people and I continue to do that. Basically, there is no part of this country where I consider myself a stranger. Absolutely not. Absolutely not.
If third term had survived, what would you have done?
Third term would never have survived. What if it had survived? It would never have survived (general laughter). We worked together. You and I worked together to abort it and we worked together, not only you and I, from all parts of this country. So, how could it have survived? Are you in cordial relationship with your former boss, Obasanjo especially as he is believed to be romancing with your party, APC? We have maintained a cordial relationship.
Many believe that you are relating warmly with the ex-President so as to get his endorsement for the ticket of APC?
I don’t know about that. I have not even yet declared whether I am running or not running. Not until that is done, I cannot say anything on that. But the impression is that you moved to APC because of your presidential ambition… No. That is not the reason. I moved to APC because I was not relevant in PDP. I said it. And I am a politician; I desire to make input to the growth of the country. I still want to leave a better country for my children. For me, I would have said to hell, but I have children, I have young people, I want to bequeath a better country for them.
After almost 16 years of governance, do you think your former party, the PDP, is fair in terms of internal democracy?
I think PDP lost focus and track from 2003. It deviated from the basic principles that we came together to form the party for. And it continues on that. It is no longer what we formed at the beginning Can you sincerely isolate yourself from PDP problems given the fact that you just said that it started in 2003 when you were still a factor? I cannot isolate myself because from 2003 when the president and myself took different positions, there was no more governance. In his second term, we were still busy fighting. So, the entire focus of governance that we set up during our first tenure; the economic reforms, this and that, everything was abandoned and we continued fighting till the end. How were you able to survive that fight? Because I was right. Even your boys, Nuhu Ribadu and Nasir el-Rfuai, abandoned you.
How did you feel at that time?
When I spoke to one of them, he said it was a power game and that they wanted power too.
At the moment, when you sit at the table of the APC, el-Rufai will be there, Ribadu will be there, Buhari will be there. How do you feel?
As a politician and as a democrat, if you cannot manage differences, then you should not be there. You shouldn’t be there. I think it is part of leadership. You should be able to manage others. There was a report suggesting that the presidency has been shut against Atiku in the APC… The presidency has been shut against me? Yes. That the door has been shut against Atiku… No. APC has not shut their door against anyone. Not with the caliber of politicians that are in APC now. I mean, if you look at the APC now, it is not a place where you can go and joke.
Is your desire to rule Nigeria out of a wish to serve or ego to be president of Nigeria?
The question of ego is not there because I am not a man of ego. And then, the question of rulership is not there. Maybe you need to rephrase your question. Maybe governance, to serve. And as long as I am alive and strong, I would want to contribute. I told you I have children. I want to leave a better country for them and so, it is a desire to serve in whatever capacity. I don’t need to be a president. What are you expecting from the ongoing confab? I have already made a statement about the confab. I said it is an afterthought. I do not see anything that is going to come out of it. It is an afterthought. It is not in the programme of this president, so it is an afterthought. APC’s decision to participate in the conference is also an afterthought? No. It is not an afterthought.
How is it an afterthought?
Initially, they said they were not going to be part of it. I am not even aware that they are now part of it. We have heard you express concern about the insecurity in this country and the situation is not getting better. Do you have a strategy they can use to solve this problem? I am not a security expert. But I know I will tend to agree with the Governor of Borno State who said our security services are badly motivated; are badly equipped and not enough of intelligence is being used and the support of the local people and inhabitants is also absent. If you can even compare with what happened (in Maiduguri), but for the support of the local people, it would have been almost impossible for the military to subdue those (Boko Haram) boys. So, I will agree with the Governor of Borno State.
What have you been doing with your private life since you left office as vice president?
I think this has been the best part of my life. Sometimes, it is good to be out of public office really because when you are in public office, you don’t seem to have time for your family, friends and other social activities. But once you are out of it, you have a more relaxed atmosphere. Most top public officers hardly eat because of their busy schedule; this might have been the case with you. Could you lead us into your eating habit now? Now I take all my three meals: I take my breakfast, I take my lunch, I take my dinner. But, mostly, the diet is either fish and vegetables, or chicken and vegetables that is all that I take. No pounded yam? No, no, no. No pounded yam, no rice. You appear to be growing younger, what is the secret? It is because of the way I live. I mean, honestly, I am enjoying my life out of office. I have more time for my family, my kids and my businesses. Of course, I don’t run my businesses. They are all being run by associates or family members. So, I am relaxing. How else do you live? I sleep when I like, I wake up when I like. It is not like when you are in public office, whether you like it or not, you have to get up as early as six. When I was a vice president, after my early morning prayers, I don’t go back to sleep until I attend to all my memos and my files because I was one kind of person who did not leave any one file or memo unattended to for more than a day. It was not easy but I ensured I did that. Nothing disturbs me now. Even as you relax, there is something that should be disturbing you –the situation in Nigeria… You are quite right. What area? I have never been so disturbed in all my life about Nigeria as I am now.
Why?
Nothing seems to be going right for us. Nothing! Absolutely nothing! So, whether it is politics; whether it is governance; whether it is business… Forget about all these growth numbers they give: we are growing by 7.6, 7.5 per cent, this and that. Where is the growth? As far as the ordinary man is concerned there is no growth. Once the ordinary man’s life is not better, there is no growth.
Culled from New Telegraph
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